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HELP!!! Golf won't start. MAF and camshaft sensor question


 
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HELP!!! Golf won't start. MAF and camshaft sensor question
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mkeehn0101



Joined: 18 Apr 2008
Posts: 44



Post HELP!!! Golf won't start. MAF and camshaft sensor question Reply with quote
Today I changed out the timing belt and tensioner just for good measure. I got everything back together again and it started up fine but reports on the OBD: P0102, P0341, and P1340. I did a little research and found out P0341 meant I screwed up with the intermediate shaft while changing the belt (crankshaft position sensor). Thinking that I could avoid having to tear into the timing belt again, I loosened up the distributor cap and moved it slightly to compensate for my screw up (it's off by like one or two teeth on the timing belt). It idled still, but the roughness cleared up (aka: it idled like when I first got it) when I turned the cap approx. 10 degrees clockwise.

However, I took it for a test drive and it still felt like it had missing power spots. I turned around to come back home and the Golf suddenly decided to die on me just exiting a stop light. I manage to get it to a safe spot for towing. Long story short, it's back in my driveway but now she won't start anymore. I'm guessing I'm gonna have to go back in and readjust the intermediate shaft. But the not starting doesn't make any sense to me...even though the camshaft sensor is out of whack, why would she have started up, ran, only to die during a test run (note: there were no further adjustments made to the distributor after I "normalized" idle)?

I am thinking the MAF finally crapped out, or was dead this whole time (OBD code P0102 is MAF circuit low input). I decided to test the theory out and was able to drive the car around the block with the MAF disconnected (note: idle did not change with or without MAF connected).

How should I approach this? Was I wrong to think that turning the distributor would compensate for my error in the timing belt replacement? Would replacing the MAF allow the Golf to start again? Or is there something else I am completely overlooking?

Thanks.
Sat Apr 26, 2008 11:29 pm View user's profile Send private message
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mkeehn0101



Joined: 18 Apr 2008
Posts: 44



Post Reply with quote
Update: tonight the Golf now starts up like nothing ever happened. With any luck, i'll take it to the shop tomorrow and correct the timing belt issue.

Question: where can I find dirt-cheap MAF sensors?
Sun Apr 27, 2008 12:29 am View user's profile Send private message
mkeehn0101



Joined: 18 Apr 2008
Posts: 44



Post Reply with quote
Another update, I started the car this morning...a little hesitation but still ran okay. I drive it to the repair shop to park until Tuesday. I notice that when the car thermostat got up to the 1/2 mark, it started dying on me again.

Why would the car run okay on cold, but die when it's warm?
Sun Apr 27, 2008 3:12 pm View user's profile Send private message
volkshaus



Joined: 29 Nov 2007
Posts: 1026
Location: Elk Grove, CA.

1992 Volkswagen Corrado

Post Reply with quote
temp sensor was telling computer that she is getting warm and it's time to start controling fuel.
based by MAF,ECT Ho2S these all play a part plus timing.

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http://www.vortexautomotive.com
Mon Apr 28, 2008 5:18 pm View user's profile Send private message
mkeehn0101



Joined: 18 Apr 2008
Posts: 44



Post Reply with quote
Not sure if anybody else knows of this website, but it helped me a great deal with checking the timing belt tonight.

http://faculty.ccp.edu/faculty/dreed/Campingart/jettatech/t-belt/index.htm

I got the intermediate shaft corrected, even double checked by pulling off the distributor cap. Did a dry run for a few seconds (no accessories attached), seemed to idle fine. I'll put everything back together tomorrow and check around for an MAF replacement.
Wed Apr 30, 2008 1:56 am View user's profile Send private message
mkeehn0101



Joined: 18 Apr 2008
Posts: 44



Post Reply with quote
Found a MAF sensor for cheap, person is overnighting it to me so I'll get it tomorrow. My Golf is still at the shop, I just have to put everything back together. However, I could not for the life of me perfectly align TDC on the camshaft and make the "O" mark on the flywheel line up perfectly. When the flywheel lines up at "O", the camshaft reads almost 1/2 tooth counter-clockwise on the TDC mark (TDC arrow is almost pointing at "T" on camshaft sprocket-wheel). Despite this, the engine idled fine during my dry run.

I am considering the timing belt issue resolved as per the website I referenced to in my previous post. The site referenced to the Bentley manual and it's statement that it's okay to be 1/2 tooth off on timing after belt adjustment (exactly what happened to me). Now, it's on to determine if the dying at operating temp is still occuring.
Wed Apr 30, 2008 2:41 pm View user's profile Send private message
volkshaus



Joined: 29 Nov 2007
Posts: 1026
Location: Elk Grove, CA.

1992 Volkswagen Corrado

Post Reply with quote
Great thanks for keeping us updated on what you are finding.

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Wed Apr 30, 2008 5:52 pm View user's profile Send private message
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mkeehn0101



Joined: 18 Apr 2008
Posts: 44



Post Reply with quote
Got the MAF sensor today. Installed and engine still ran rough. In fact, I smelled unburned gas at the exhaust pipe. The check engine light was flashing as well. From reading on the internet, that means the emissions system is jacked up (not positive in this case however). Have not had a chance to hook up OBDII reader yet. I have a little hope as all the signs are not pointing to physical mechanical damage, but rather to the fuel management system itself. I would have to kill myself if I screwed up the timing belt THAT bad (not my first time in an engine, but I do remember why I hated timing belts vs. chains so much).

So I have a question, now that I have a working MAF, what could be causing the rough idle and gas smell? Would there be anything I could test without running the engine to operating temp? Could I use a multimeter to check voltage levels on a cold engine? If so, what are the values I should be looking for?


Thanks.
Fri May 02, 2008 2:17 am View user's profile Send private message
mkeehn0101



Joined: 18 Apr 2008
Posts: 44



Post Reply with quote
Update: Got OBDII codes: P0300 (random/multiple cylinder misfires detected), P0303 (cylinder 3 misfire detected), and P0302 (cylinder 2 misfire detected). I replaced the spark plug wires (holy H*ll! they are expensive! BTW), problem still occurred. Pulled the plugs, black and wet from fuel, checked for spark...inconsistent spark output (bosch platinum 2 plugs). Thought I would bring my old plugs and test them (perhaps because they are coated with so much fuel, electrodes aren't working correctly). Today I went back with the old plugs, spark still seems to be a little odd (tested between 1 and 2 plugs). Also did a compression test to verify no physical damage occurred. Readings are as follows:

Cylinder 1: 185
Cylinder 2: 180
Cylinder 3: 185
Cylinder 4: 180

The Haynes manual says the compression should only be 109 PSI (I think that's BS considering this is an interference engine. The 180PSI seems much more plausible.) So that ruled out any physical damage plus verifies that timing is correct (valves are opening and closing like they should). After being rather exasperated with this whole experience, I called the guy I bought her from (a VW mechanic). He said to check the ignition coil by throwing water on it. If the engine dies, then that's the part. He added that his shop replaces about 1 coil a month due to it being a high failure item on VW's. I will be going back later today to test the coil, if it dies, then hooyah! I will know exactly what needs to be replaced.
Sat May 03, 2008 5:28 pm View user's profile Send private message
mkeehn0101



Joined: 18 Apr 2008
Posts: 44



Post Reply with quote
Update on my update. Disconnected and removed the spark plug coil. Wow! I'm surprised the coil even worked at all. It's cracked all over the place, even looks like rust in the biggest crack. Not to sound overly optimistic, but I think the problem has just been discovered. I just have to wait for a replacement to arrive next week. I'll let everyone know if it solves the problem or not.
Sat May 03, 2008 10:54 pm View user's profile Send private message
volkshaus



Joined: 29 Nov 2007
Posts: 1026
Location: Elk Grove, CA.

1992 Volkswagen Corrado

Post Reply with quote
thanks for the update

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Mon May 05, 2008 4:51 pm View user's profile Send private message
mkeehn0101



Joined: 18 Apr 2008
Posts: 44



Post Reply with quote
Update: THE V-DUB LIVES AGAIN!!!! Haynes manual is a complete liar. Ignition firing order is supposed to be 1,3,4,2. Haynes said 1,2,4,3. I'll have to go to the auto parts store and see if they released a revision to that (I have an old secondhand copy). After digging online, I found out the real firing order of the engine (plus a very helpful VW mechanic verified my findings).

So, case closed. The real fix was the ignition coil DID need to be replaced. However, when I swapped out the cap and rotor, I blindly followed Haynes advise and did the plug wires in the incorrect order. BTW: my Haynes manual also says cylinder compression should be approx. 110PSI (I got 180-185PSI in my tests). Also, I admit I completely nuked (overthinking a simple task) this diagnostic. I should have double-checked the ignition timing from the get-go.

So, in summary: if you get a flashing cel, and the OBDII reads misfire on any cylinders; double-check the ignition coil for cracks. Mine didn't bog down when I splashed water on it, but it was pretty bad regardless. Also: unless Haynes has their act together, don't trust their ignition sequence. It should always be 1,3,4,2 (VW mechanic stated this is always true on VW 4-cylinder engines).

I hope this helps anybody else who is encountering the same issue.
Tue May 06, 2008 4:41 pm View user's profile Send private message
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